EVcast #188: Panel Discussion: Gint Federas, Sebastian Blanco, and Ian Clifford

Hydrogen as automotive fuel dead? It should be but it still has backers. Ignore them.

Mileage Tax? It makes no sense to bother discussing now. When there is a significant % of EVs out on highways, then we can discuss it. But for now, let the heavier polluters pay for the roads.

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Yes we need to rethink the car.  Our devotion to high speed heavy vehicles kills 40000 Americans a year and injures 1 Million.  At 70 mph we need 4 times more distance to stop and 4 times more damage on impact than at 35 mph. It requires 8 times more power to overcome air resistance which becomes the dominant factor when traveling above 40 mph.

   We need more options of lighter, slower electric vehicles that can be used for most single passenger commuting, shopping and recreation.  I have been using a solar powered vehicle for over 5 years which gets its energy from solar panels on its roof.  The solar energy gets stored in Lithium Fe Phosphate batteries which drive two electric motors with less than 4 HP.  The vehicle will go up to 35 mph and weighs only 300 lbs without a rider.   Check out www.sunzeecar.com or Google Ecotrike. 

Andy Schoenberg Salt Lake City

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milage tax?
The easiest tax that relates to road use and wear is the amount of energy consumed. A joule tax would be best. Of course, with home charging, this tax could be avoided. But if the efficiency of the vehicle (joule/km) is known and driving habits somewhat recorded then milage could be taxed.

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Wow!  Very good show to listen to guys!  Thank you Gint, Sebastian and Ian for your insights and thoughts on the EV and car industry.  What can I say- we all seem to be in agreement on most things- Hygrogen is a terrible choice for cars, mileage tax is a horribly inefficient way to collect taxes, it is not good to let the present Detroit Auto Makers fail---and the next two years will be very, very interesting;-)

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The EcoTrike looks pretty cool.  Here is a link to his video.

http://www.sunzeecar.com/ecotrike/sunzeecar/Video.html

But this more like a 3-wheel bicycle that has been electrified.  So it is probably more appropriate for the person used to dealing with the risks of biking through a city.

   I find discussion about the EcoTrike to odd juxtaposition between safety issues caused by our current vehicles and and the implied solution of the "safe" EcoTrike".  Sure the EcoTrike is more efficient and more "sensible" for the run to the local store.  However, I not sure I starting with a discussion about safety problems is the best way to promote a vehicle that has very little crash protection and can go 30MPH.

     Sadly, I am one person that cannot even imagine driving the EcoTrike through the streets of Boston.  Even at 30MPH, a little more crash worthiness for this husband and father of 2 seems appropriate.

    But a great concept vehicle.

Later
John C. Briggs

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Sebastian said,
     "So much of the electrical grid is underutilized at night and we are wasting all this energy and if we could just charge our batteries at night well then that would be good for many reasons. ...
      You could also use that energy to electrolyze water.  and I just don't know why hydrogen community isn't pushing that more. Because, that, to me, makes a lot of sense.  ... But any time that you are using power that is already generated right now and being able to store it, being able to use it later, basically getting free energy, ..."

    I fear there is some serious confusion of the facts here.

    Firstly, power plants are not wasting electricity at night.  They reduce their output, or shutdown completely at night.  When power is needed, they increase output or turn on.   If we have to crank the power plants up at night to power cars (hydrogen or xEV) then more natural gas, coal, etc, will be used.  This is NOT FREE ENERGY.

    Secondly, the point of night charging is that the power lines and power plants are underutilized at night.  They have more capacity that could be used if we want to.  We don't need to add new power plants to accomplish nighttime charging.  However, it will use much more energy.  Again, this is NOT FREE ENERGY just free capacity to deliver the energy.

    Thirdly, it takes 3 to 4 times more electricity to propel a hydrogen car then it does to propel and xEV.  It is simply a non-starter.

Later
John C. Briggs

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The Ecotrike is an interesting vehicle, and at least it is enclosed with a fair amount of storage- reminds me a bit of the BugE vehicle:  http://www.bugev.net/BugE_Concept.html

The BugE looks a lot better, goes faster- but is not completely enclosed.  However, John, I must agree with you- being the father of two myself- much too easy to get hurt in either of these on a busy street.  If the crash didn't kill me, my wife would;-)

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